Morrissey Central "HOLD ON, I’M CARMEN" (January 1, 2025)

Carmen Vandenberg working very hard at rehearsals for the New Year's Eve show at the Hollywood Palladium.
Photographs by Rudolpho.

HOLD ON, I'M CARMEN - MESSAGES FROM MORRISSEY - MORRISSEY CENTRAL - HOLD ON, I'M CARMEN

MESSAGES FROM MORRISSEY on MORRISSEY CENTRAL

www.morrisseycentral.com

 

[Catholic]

Most band members have talked about some aspects of Morrissey's 'inner workings' at times (with some then melting down like Spencer - later retracted).

Thanks for this FWD—as so much else. Could you tell us any more about the situation with Spencer, particularly the retraction?

I cannot help but wonder if Morrissey's greatest co-writer (after Marr, bien sur) might be Spencer Cobrin . . . even if there's only four tracks to go on.

Which is why the retraction especially interests me.

But grateful for any details/links from you or anyone else about him. Has he written other songs beside the four with Morrissey? (That is: Lost; Now I am a Was; Wide to Receive and the slow version of Hard to Walk Tall, as, of course you, FWD, know far better than I do.)

 

[Famous when dead]

Thanks for this FWD—as so much else. Could you tell us any more about the situation with Spencer, particularly the retraction?

I cannot help but wonder if Morrissey's greatest co-writer (after Marr, bien sur) might be Spencer Cobrin . . . even if there's only four tracks to go on.

Which is why the retraction especially interests me.

But grateful for any details/links from you or anyone else about him. Has he written other songs beside the four with Morrissey? (That is: Lost; Now I am a Was; Wide to Receive and the slow version of Hard to Walk Tall, as, of course you, FWD, know far better than I do.)

Spencer Cobrin FB: Trump/Morrissey comments (June 21, 2020)

UPDATE June 21 2:25 PM PT: Posted by Alexi: There's activity in the comments section, but given this topic has been done to absolute death - I won't paste it all here. Visit his FB page for more: (Update: Spencer deactivated his FB account this afternoon after the apology)...

www.morrissey-solo.com

The 'sorry' came after deactivating FB and reappearing. I believe people 'had a word' at that point. He went very quiet thereafter. Previously, he'd been humerours with things like showing his Spotify cheque for $0.04616 - earnings for "Now I Am A Was" or talking about the leak here of IHTWTIYS. He's scaled all of that back now.
Regards,
FWD.

 

[Catholic]

Many thanks!

 

[Phranc & Open]

Gannon, Whyte, Day and Cobrin should become Mozzer's new band for 2025 with Boz at the helm and Gustavo on occasional live keys (excluding LIHS and WPINOYB).

 

[MozIsGod]

This is very confusingly worded. I'm not aware that Alain ever compared his leaving to Johnny, though I'm happy to be proven otherwise.

I believe what the poster may be referring to is this:

Posted by Alain Whyte / Facebook:
April 27, 2016

"25 years ago today I played my first gig with Morrissey in Dublin, I thought we were crap when we first started but this gig at the Hammersmith Odeon proves me wrong. We had a great thing going. Gaz,Spencer, Boz and I embarked on a journey. Gaz, Spencer and I were in a band before we joined Moz. We were rough around the edges but we had so much energy. It was too bad this line up didn't last. I was not happy when Spen and Gaz were not on the Vauxhall and I record. I was not told until I arrived in the studio. Your Arsenal was better and Mick was the catalyst for making that record. Had he lived maybe Vauxhall would have been different. I don't know what it is about Dublin my first gig with Morrissey and it happened to be my last gig also. On June 23rd 2004 my last show was in Dublin. Tired and exhausted the years of good people coming and going took its tale. I guess I left for the same reasons as Johnny Marr. Like What Joe Strummer said when you have good cohesion with a band, don't mess with it. One day the story of how that line up happened will be told. Maybe one day I'll write a book."

 

[Seymour Glass]

How about you learn how to play the songs before you take a smoke break??

 

[Seymour Glass]

Gannon, Whyte, Day and Cobrin should become Mozzer's new band for 2025 with Boz at the helm and Gustavo on occasional live keys (excluding LIHS and WPINOYB).

Only in our dreams...

 

[dneuer]

Once again, I really appreciate Alain's and Darrin's matter-of-fact and reserved approach to Morrissey. At the end of the day, the fans remember the two departures and Morrissey's autobiographical irritations, that Alain wanted to be more or less equal. Since Darrin has, so far, answered questions here as well as he could, but has remained stubbornly silent about the re-recordings, I have to assume that Alain's and Gustavo's compositional contributions may have been replaced after all. Some of them could have been Tobias', couldn't they? Since polite silence has almost always prevailed so far regarding the second exit and Alain wants to get his solo career off to a flying start, the deletion of his (presumably) final contributions for Morrisey would certainly not be conducive. What do you think?

Heya… sorry. I may be stubborn at times, but twas not my intent this time
My time has been limited for replies recently, but for now I’ll just throw this out there…

Truth is, Alain doesn’t know which songs were dropped. As of our last conversation there was no mention of being informed of this possibility. Based on Carmen’s (that’s her, right?) recording posts combined with the interview stuff noting number of songs, it doesn’t take FWD’s level of sleuthdom to see it as a possibility if one counts the number of tracks AW and Gus were involved in and compare the tallies.

Personally, and again my input only… I really don’t think M would be so petty as to remove Al’s tunes simply because he and Gus stood up for themselves and refused to endure an increasing level of disrespect during their tenure in the band. If he is and has, so be it. There isn’t much to be said or done, but in the end it would be the fans… fans that have longed to hear AW resurrect what was generally considered to be M’s most appreciated (and successful) post-Smiths co-writing partnership, that will continue to feel cheated. Oh, well. M has his strongest band ever… and I’m sure the fans will be cool with it regardless of what some that have attended recent shows say. There’s plenty of room for both bands. Go see shows or buy material by whichever bands you dig. It looks like there should be plenty of both in this new year.

 

[Redacted]

Heya… sorry. I may be stubborn at times, but twas not my intent this time
My time has been limited for replies recently, but for now I’ll just throw this out there…

Truth is, Alain doesn’t know which songs were dropped. As of our last conversation there was no mention of being informed of this possibility. Based on Carmen’s (that’s her, right?) recording posts combined with the interview stuff noting number of songs, it doesn’t take FWD’s level of sleuthdom to see it as a possibility if one counts the number of tracks AW and Gus were involved in and compare the tallies.

Personally, and again my input only… I really don’t think M would be so petty as to remove Al’s tunes simply because he and Gus stood up for themselves and refused to endure an increasing level of disrespect during their tenure in the band. If he is and has, so be it. There isn’t much to be said or done, but in the end it would be the fans… fans that have longed to hear AW resurrect what was generally considered to be M’s most appreciated (and successful) post-Smiths co-writing partnership, that will continue to feel cheated. Oh, well. M has his strongest band ever… and I’m sure the fans will be cool with it regardless of what some that have attended recent shows say. There’s plenty of room for both bands. Go see shows or buy material by whichever bands you dig. It looks like there should be plenty of both in this new year.

Thanks for the giant info drop and Happy New Year!
Morrissey really should take into consideration that Alain does have his own fanbase, I know when I saw him without Alain it seemed something was missing. I will never forget the first time, seeing Alain's swagger on stage, he was just so cool and really has a presence that is missing. Carmen cannot match that or even come close no matter how many corny poses she strikes.

 

[Lujan369]

Estas fotos de Carmen me están gustando cada vez más. Me alegro de que estén en la página de inicio, así me acuerdo de ellas a menudo. Me pregunto si esto significa que haré un retrato de ella.

n.NAAA quien la conoce?

 

[Phranc & Open]

Heya… sorry. I may be stubborn at times, but twas not my intent this time
My time has been limited for replies recently, but for now I’ll just throw this out there…

Truth is, Alain doesn’t know which songs were dropped. As of our last conversation there was no mention of being informed of this possibility. Based on Carmen’s (that’s her, right?) recording posts combined with the interview stuff noting number of songs, it doesn’t take FWD’s level of sleuthdom to see it as a possibility if one counts the number of tracks AW and Gus were involved in and compare the tallies.

Personally, and again my input only… I really don’t think M would be so petty as to remove Al’s tunes simply because he and Gus stood up for themselves and refused to endure an increasing level of disrespect during their tenure in the band. If he is and has, so be it. There isn’t much to be said or done, but in the end it would be the fans… fans that have longed to hear AW resurrect what was generally considered to be M’s most appreciated (and successful) post-Smiths co-writing partnership, that will continue to feel cheated. Oh, well. M has his strongest band ever… and I’m sure the fans will be cool with it regardless of what some that have attended recent shows say. There’s plenty of room for both bands. Go see shows or buy material by whichever bands you dig. It looks like there should be plenty of both in this new year.

Thank you very much. I knew, you would stay as neutral as possible. One last thing, if it fits: can you (or Alain) say, if the studio version of Notre-Dame played now after the last concert is the original one?

 

[Ryan]

Heya… sorry. I may be stubborn at times, but twas not my intent this time
My time has been limited for replies recently, but for now I’ll just throw this out there…

Truth is, Alain doesn’t know which songs were dropped. As of our last conversation there was no mention of being informed of this possibility. Based on Carmen’s (that’s her, right?) recording posts combined with the interview stuff noting number of songs, it doesn’t take FWD’s level of sleuthdom to see it as a possibility if one counts the number of tracks AW and Gus were involved in and compare the tallies.

Personally, and again my input only… I really don’t think M would be so petty as to remove Al’s tunes simply because he and Gus stood up for themselves and refused to endure an increasing level of disrespect during their tenure in the band. If he is and has, so be it. There isn’t much to be said or done, but in the end it would be the fans… fans that have longed to hear AW resurrect what was generally considered to be M’s most appreciated (and successful) post-Smiths co-writing partnership, that will continue to feel cheated. Oh, well. M has his strongest band ever… and I’m sure the fans will be cool with it regardless of what some that have attended recent shows say. There’s plenty of room for both bands. Go see shows or buy material by whichever bands you dig. It looks like there should be plenty of both in this new year.

I wonder how the “original” version of WMTWD will surface - the version that originally intended to have 12 songs?

Will he release this newly recorded version with a new title, then in ten years’ time release an “expanded edition” with the original 12 track version featuring Alain being released as disc two?

There is so much unreleased and alternate versions of songs in the vaults now it should be at its tipping point.

 

[Phranc & Open]

I wonder how the “original” version of WMTWD will surface - the version that originally intended to have 12 songs?

Will he release this newly recorded version with a new title, then in ten years’ time release an “expanded edition” with the original 12 track version featuring Alain being released as disc two?

There is so much unreleased and alternate versions of songs in the vaults now it should be at its tipping point.

Today, expanded editions only need christmas time of the year of release to gladly let you pay twice for the same music + some beloved bonus material. 2-3 new tracks will do nicely. Thank you.

 

[SuedeMoz]

I cannot help but wonder if Morrissey's greatest co-writer (after Marr, bien sur) might be Spencer Cobrin . . . even if there's only four tracks to go on.

Maybe after Marr, Street, Whyte, Boorer, and Nevin but before Tobias.

 

[Light Housework]

So true, and that's what I like about her !

Her toughness is inspirational. It’s liberating to me as a female who was thoroughly brainwashed by the glamour magazines to always aim to be demure and coquettish. I’m noticing her ‘masculinity' playing into my own body language as I make coffee this morning. hahaha

 

[Redacted]

It looks like she is trying and failing to copy the cover of Marr's Guitars

 

[Light Housework]

It looks like she is trying and failing to copy the cover of Marr's Guitars

It’s just as likely that she’s trying to emulate Kylie Minogue.

 

[Simplysmiths]

I believe what the poster may be referring to is this:

Posted by Alain Whyte / Facebook:
April 27, 2016

"25 years ago today I played my first gig with Morrissey in Dublin, I thought we were crap when we first started but this gig at the Hammersmith Odeon proves me wrong. We had a great thing going. Gaz,Spencer, Boz and I embarked on a journey. Gaz, Spencer and I were in a band before we joined Moz. We were rough around the edges but we had so much energy. It was too bad this line up didn't last. I was not happy when Spen and Gaz were not on the Vauxhall and I record. I was not told until I arrived in the studio. Your Arsenal was better and Mick was the catalyst for making that record. Had he lived maybe Vauxhall would have been different. I don't know what it is about Dublin my first gig with Morrissey and it happened to be my last gig also. On June 23rd 2004 my last show was in Dublin. Tired and exhausted the years of good people coming and going took its tale. I guess I left for the same reasons as Johnny Marr. Like What Joe Strummer said when you have good cohesion with a band, don't mess with it. One day the story of how that line up happened will be told. Maybe one day I'll write a book."

Yes it is but I also read somewhere Alain challenged Morrissey about letting good people go and that is a no no isn’t it. Why do you think Johnny didn’t challenge him about golden lights etc

 

[Simplysmiths]

Only in our dreams...

Well he wouldn’t struggle to get a record deal that’s for sure

 

[Simplysmiths]

I guess the haters will see this as “a thinly veiled dig at her abilities” …or something.

By all accounts they/them has very little ability so I think it’s a fair comment to make…,,,fortunately I saw Alain in the band and not this Dorris