Morrissey and Wine podcast: The comeback that never happened (November 15, 2024)

Hi everyone. On the latest episode of the Morrissey and Wine podcast, we discuss a conversation with an insider that revealed the plan for Morrissey's comeback before he split with Pete Galli, including residencies in London, New York and Los Angeles, the release of Bonfire and Without Music, a big payday for Moz and the launch of a fan club - plus more. While, in our judgement, the source is genuine, it's always important to take any information provided with a pinch of salt.

We also address our comments on the last episode where we referred to this forum as "toxic". We reflected and we feel that we could have worded things better. Almost everyone on here has been very supportive of our podcast so we shouldn't have been so lazy with our words.

Nanny Val reacts to 'Kerouac's Crack', the ten-question trivia quiz returns and the boys analyse 'I Ex-Love You'. We hope you enjoy it. Listen on your favourite podcast platform here: https://podfollow.com/morrissey-and-wine

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Related item:

• Alain Whyte gives 'Morrissey and Wine' podcast sneak peek at new Moz album

Related thread:

• Inside information on Moz, Marr & management

 

[Multi]

hmmm, interesting. Is that all?

off a single song mp3, yes.

but hey, i recognize the fact that all of us here will listen to Moz sing over a toilet flushing at least once, but don't throw shade just because some of us recognize that there's shit in the water that you're lapping up.

 

[Anonymous]

Right, it's Morrissey's claim and Marr's counter-claim. One of the two is wrong, but Marr is far more believable because there's no way he wouldn't see the phoniness in re-forming the Smiths w/out Morrissey. Any "insider" repeating Morrissey's claim is dubious.

The obvious thing would be someone asks Brandon Flowers - 'Hey, I heard you were approached to replace Morrissey in a reformed Smiths - is that correct?'.

Personally I can't see Johnny attempting this whatsoever, as it completely runs counter to everything he's stood for in the past when it comes to protecting The Smiths's legacy. But possibly there was an idea floated of a combined solo tour, or some kind of 'Flowers and Marr perform the songs of the Smiths' thing that Morrissey caught wind of and translated into the pair performing AS The Smiths (which is a very different thing). But surely Flowers could shed some light on the rumour?

 

[Multi]

I have been saying this myself since I purchased it upon release. Sounds tinny. But maybe I have been listening to it through inferior speakers. If the production was supposed to reflect the artistic genius of the young Andrew Watt, it’s disappointing to me. And that’s an opinion. I’m not a music pro, so take it with a grain of salt.

But we enjoy the song at my house regardless. I prefer it live to the tinny-sounding production. Is that just me?

it really does sound tinny. Andrew Watt is a hot name due to reviving a few careers (Ozzy, etc) and was available through the covid drought. the guy is far from a Mick Ronson, Steve Lillywhite or Joe Chiccarelli -- while i know some here don't like the additional sounds Chiccarelli has brought to the show, he runs a tight production and he's very good at mixing.

 

[ZOOM FROM GLOOM]

off a single song mp3, yes.

but hey, i recognize the fact that all of us here will listen to Moz sing over a toilet flushing at least once, but don't throw shade just because some of us recognize that there's shit in the water that you're lapping up.

I prefer the live version.

 

[Multi]

I prefer the live version.

any sensible person would.

 

[ZOOM FROM GLOOM]

any sensible person would.

in that case, I love the studio version!

 

[Roman Holiday]

I was talking about The Smiths reforming ….

Okay. That's up to them, I guess. Morrissey did recently make it seem like it would be a good deal about the money, but even still, I think they should be considered the Smiths even without Rourke and Joyce. Keith Moon was an integral part of the Who—his drumming was as standout as Rourke's bass-playing—but the Who were reasonably the Who without him. Johnny Marr and his current band play Smiths songs exquisitely; they're (painfully) everything but the voice.

 

[ZOOM FROM GLOOM]

it really does sound tinny. Andrew Watt is a hot name due to reviving a few careers (Ozzy, etc) and was available through the covid drought.

Could be wrong, and one would assume, but is that really true? Maybe I should clarify by asking first… are you saying that Morrissey chose Watt also because he was the only recorder/producer available at the time?

the guy is far from a Mick Ronson, Steve Lillywhite or Joe Chiccarelli -- while i know some here don't like the additional sounds Chiccarelli has brought to the show, he runs a tight production and he's very good at mixing.

 

[ZOOM FROM GLOOM]

Okay. That's up to them, I guess. Morrissey did recently make it seem like it would be a good deal about the money, but even still, I think they should be considered the Smiths even without Rourke and Joyce. Keith Moon was considered an integral part of the Who—his drumming was as standout as Rourke's bass-playing—but the Who were still reasonably the Who without him. Johnny Marr and his current band play the Smiths songs exquisitely; they're (painfully) everything but the voice.

My point was, that Johnny would not be found guilty by association if he said he took the stage with Morrissey because he can say it was for a charity, since you wrote in your first post... ‘but Marr can't need money that bad, and he knows about posterity (and the critical blow-back and sellout accusations that would surely come).
Sorry, I erroneously thought you were talking about reforming with Morrissey. But I agree with your posts anyway.

 

[Multi]

Could be wrong, and one would assume, but is that really true? Maybe I should clarify by asking first… are you saying that Morrissey chose Watt also because he was the only recorder/producer available at the time?

not just Watt, but the "band" as well.

 

[Multi]

I'm sure that's who it is, as a result of which I find myself without the appetite to sample the latest chat, for the first time. Giving more oxygen to a malicious gossip is one-sided and seems irresponsible.

i happen to believe him. like Mike, I have received information or been in on things and the way that he has disseminated it and his responses to others are very similar to how i went about it. that, his personal relationships with certain individuals and his obvious affection for Moz in general, makes me think that he's legit.

when it comes to all the Smiths stuff though i just roll my eyes as that ship is sunk.

 

[Odbmke]

I don’t know. The initial post as outlined here by @Odbmke matches up pretty closely with that has happened lately. Think about it: on announcing the Vegas shows, he made the comment about Bonfire’s release saying “good news is within our grasp”. Then came the announcement of the US tour, with Jesse’s attached message hinting at “forthcoming releases”. The user here mentioned that “I Ex-Love You” was to be the next single, and sure enough it was debuted on the first night of the tour. This, along with the recent setlists featuring Bonfire songs heavily, is the crux of it: it can’t be entirely coincidental?

As far as the idea of Johnny’s camp trying to tour as The Smiths with Brandon flowers as the lead singer, I just cannot wrap my head around that. A slap in the face to everything the smiths is

You have been paying attention.

 

[ClintBoon]

These two 'men' who do this show are nasty people who come across all nice.
I know this first hand and have seen how they treat people.

 

[SqueezingMySkull]

LOL. It is toxic. Don't apologize.

 

[Anonymous]

As far as RWC is concerned, many here said the production was well below under the par Mr Zoom from the gloom. Get a holiday man ! Or probably you never read posts.
You love to write yours ( to criticise Odbmke for instance ) but never give fresh information ! You are boring,

 

[Rat tag]

I'm sure that's who it is, as a result of which I find myself without the appetite to sample the latest chat, for the first time. Giving more oxygen to a malicious gossip is one-sided and seems irresponsible.

I expected more from Brit podcaster Moz fans . Just goes to show most Brit Moz fans are as bad as the yanks now
Worse in fact , this guy is spreading total BS about Johnny and these clowns get a solo gossip on there . lol
Also Marr turned down the gig , so how did him posting a picture of Nigel have an effect , especially as Moz liked Nig at one point ?
Nigel’s party Reform will not even let people from For Britain join , so he is more on the left than Mozzer these days . Lol

I wouldn’t be surprised if some of the other stuff is true but it’s hardly a master plan
Do you really think Moz would go straight to number one , with the new material ?
Sure it would have got the fan base excited but people outside of Moz world wouldn’t have cared

It’s hardly a surprise that Moz threw this away. He has thrown bigger chances away time and time again
Look at what he did with BMG , they had the whole thing sorted , Tv , videos the lot and he couldn’t sell that much and he wrecked the whole thing wifi his UKIP and For Britain comments and general f***ery
I can see this lot getting sued .

 

[gashonthenail]

I do believe it is entirely possible that Johnny, or Johnny's management, 'explored' the idea of Johnny touring with another 'big name' singer to perform the music of The Smiths. Who wouldn't at least consider that option? Live shows are 'where it's at' in these days where digital music sales remain fairly paltry for most artists. And knowing that Morrissey would have been upset about the news would only have added to the attractiveness of at least exploring the option. There is nothing quite like the bitterness of old friends. Whether Johnny actually would have gone ahead and taken such a step, however, is the question. Probably not. But I'm sure he enjoyed just imagining Morrissey's face on hearing the news.

 

[ForgivemeJesus]

I came across my download of the studio version of Rebels Without Applause for the first time in a while today and the production is terrible.

Can you please be more specific....

 

[Andy W]

I do believe it is entirely possible that Johnny, or Johnny's management, 'explored' the idea of Johnny touring with another 'big name' singer to perform the music of The Smiths. Who wouldn't at least consider that option? Live shows are 'where it's at' in these days where digital music sales remain fairly paltry for most artists. And knowing that Morrissey would have been upset about the news would only have added to the attractiveness of at least exploring the option. There is nothing quite like the bitterness of old friends. Whether Johnny actually would have gone ahead and taken such a step, however, is the question. Probably not. But I'm sure he enjoyed just imagining Morrissey's face on hearing the news.

Johnny not only explored this, they did it every night of the Killers tour of North America. He’d play a Smiths song with Brandon singing. I saw it with my own eyes and there’s tons of videos on YouTube of this. It’s not a new idea, no it wasn’t the Smiths, but it’s been done.

 

[Surface]

Johnny not only explored this, they did it every night of the Killers tour of North America. He’d play a Smiths song with Brandon singing. I saw it with my own eyes and there’s tons of videos on YouTube of this. It’s not a new idea, no it wasn’t the Smiths, but it’s been done.

The Killers played This Charming Man at Glastonbury with Johnny on guitar and also Mr Brightside.