Morrissey Central "YOU KNOW I COULDN’T LAST" (July 26, 2023)

YOU KNOW I COULDN'T LAST - MESSAGES FROM MORRISSEY - MORRISSEY CENTRAL - YOU KNOW I COULDN'T LAST

MESSAGES FROM MORRISSEY on MORRISSEY CENTRAL

www.morrisseycentral.com

“She had only so much ‘self’ to give. She was dropped by her label after selling 7 million albums for them. She became crazed, yes, but uninteresting, never. She had done nothing wrong. She had proud vulnerability … and there is a certain music industry hatred for singers who don’t ‘fit in’ (this I know only too well), and they are never praised until death - when, finally, they can’t answer back. The cruel playpen of fame gushes with praise for Sinead today … with the usual moronic labels of “icon” and “legend”. You praise her now ONLY because it is too late. You hadn’t the guts to support her when she was alive and she was looking for you. The press will label artists as pests because of what they withhold … and they would call Sinead sad, fat, shocking, insane … oh but not today! Music CEOs who had put on their most charming smile as they refused her for their roster are queuing-up to call her a “feminist icon”, and 15 minute celebrities and goblins from hell and record labels of artificially aroused diversity are squeezing onto Twitter to twitter their jibber-jabber … when it was YOU who talked Sinead into giving up … because she refused to be labelled, and she was degraded, as those few who move the world are always degraded. Why is ANYBODY surprised that Sinead O’Connor is dead? Who cared enough to save Judy Garland, Whitney Houston, Amy Winehouse, Marilyn Monroe, Billie Holiday? Where do you go when death can be the best outcome? Was this music madness worth Sinead’s life? No, it wasn’t. She was a challenge, and she couldn’t be boxed-up, and she had the courage to speak when everyone else stayed safely silent. She was harassed simply for being herself. Her eyes finally closed in search of a soul she could call her own. As always, the lamestreamers miss the ringing point, and with locked jaws they return to the insultingly stupid “icon” and “legend” when last week words far more cruel and dismissive would have done. Tomorrow the fawning fops flip back to their online shitposts and their cosy Cancer Culture and their moral superiority and their obituaries of parroted vomit … all of which will catch you lying on days like today … when Sinead doesn’t need your sterile slop.”

MORRISSEY
26 July, 2023.

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Related thread:

• R.I.P. Sinead O'Connor

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Media items:

• Consequence: "Morrissey Rips Sinead O’Connor Tributes: “You Hadn’t the Guts to Support Her When She Was Alive”" - July 26, 2023
• Daily Mail: "Morrissey SLAMS celebrity tributes to Sinead O'Connor following her death aged 56: 'You hadn't the guts to support her when she was alive'" - July 27, 2023
• The Independent: "I can’t believe I agree with Morrissey, but he’s right on Sinéad O’Connor" - July 27, 2023
• The Guardian: "‘You hadn’t the guts to support her’: Morrissey decries music industry after Sinéad O’Connor’s death" - July 27, 2023
• The Independent: "‘You praise her now only because it’s too late’: Morrissey lashes out at tributes to Sinead O’Connor" - July 27, 2023
• Ultimate Classic Rock: "MORRISSEY RIPS ‘INSULTINGLY STUPID’ SINEAD O’CONNOR COVERAGE" - July 26, 2023

 

[Redacted]

Just to help your (lack of) critical thinking...
Why should everything he may or may not have done relate to some public display of support?
He could have sent her a message/fax/postcard et al every day for 20+ years - why do you feel so entitled as to want to be made aware of private information that you will probably never know...?
That's a completely different issue when compared to Morrissey & Sinéad...
FWD.

By the same reasoning, how can Morrissey know who reached out to her privately and who did not? How can he know who helped her or who tried to help her? How can he make the claims he is making? And the other women in his screed? How would he know?

 

[Redacted]

I never understood why she did not receive some of of apology after the scandal about the Magdalene Laundries came out and then the church sex scandals broke here in the US. She was right and since when does the entertainment industry have such reverence for the pope. The entire thing was so bizarre. When did SNL decide it had so much reverence for the pope. Even now, even this current pope is covering up sex scandals and it is very clear that Benedict was removed because he was trying to clean things up. The Catholic Church is an evil institution and that is not a secret to anyone. I think her Arsenio Hall appearance was after the pope thing and they talked about it and he was really kind and warm to her, and he also told her Sting had been there the week before and said wonderful things about her Arsenio was going to send her a tape of it to play whenever she was feeling down. I do think there was a lot of support for her and I don't agree women can't perform when they are older and still be considered sexy - Debbie Harry, Siouxsie, Shirley Manson, Pat Benatar and others are doing it right now.


I think this is 1998

 

[ACTON]

https://www.rollingstone.com/music/...onnor-dead-tribute-shirley-manson-1234798310/

 

[gashonthenail]

By the same reasoning, how can Morrissey know who reached out to her privately and who did not? How can he know who helped her or who tried to help her? How can he make the claims he is making? And the other women in his screed? How would he know?

Again, no one knows or can comment on what help may or may not have been offered privately. Sinéad O'Connor herself did provide some evidence though about things that happened in private that must have been awful to experience, if true.
But it is ok surely to comment on public displays of hatred and vitriol directed towards her? It is the public attacks on her that Moz is commenting on. There was plenty of that over the years. And her own distrust of the music industry à la Paint A Vulgar Picture was widely reported.
In terms of the 'other women' mentioned - Judy Garland, Whitney Houston, Amy Winehouse, Marilyn Monroe, Billie Holiday - it's just very flattering to mention Sinéad in the same sentence as them. Kind of sets out her legacy. Sinéad would blush at the flattery - but it's true to rate her talent along with them. No higher praise. To say the statement is all about Moz is just inaccurate. It contains some real praise of Sinéad O'Connor both as a human being and as an artist.

Sinéad O’Connor told children to “call my accountant” before emergency services in event of her death

She passed away at her home in London last Wednesday

www.nme.com

Sinead O’Connor claims she was encouraged to have an abortion by record executive and doctor

Singer-songwriter claims she was told she “owed it to” the record label not to have her first child

www.independent.co.uk

 

[BrokenFrame]

 

[Crisstti]

Some people here don't care for music, or art, they only care for politics.
Very strange.

Yes. It's actually a very shallow attitude.

 

[Crisstti]

Again, no one knows or can comment on what help may or may not have been offered privately. Sinéad O'Connor herself did provide some evidence though about things that happened in private that must have been awful to experience, if true.
But it is ok surely to comment on public displays of hatred and vitriol directed towards her? It is the public attacks on her that Moz is commenting on. There was plenty of that over the years. And her own distrust of the music industry à la Paint A Vulgar Picture was widely reported.
In terms of the 'other women' mentioned - Judy Garland, Whitney Houston, Amy Winehouse, Marilyn Monroe, Billie Holiday - it's just very flattering to mention Sinéad in the same sentence as them. Kind of sets out her legacy. Sinéad would blush at the flattery - but it's true to rate her talent along with them. No higher praise. To say the statement is all about Moz is just inaccurate. It contains some real praise of Sinéad O'Connor both as a human being and as an artist.

Sinéad O’Connor told children to “call my accountant” before emergency services in event of her death

She passed away at her home in London last Wednesday

www.nme.com

Sinead O’Connor claims she was encouraged to have an abortion by record executive and doctor

Singer-songwriter claims she was told she “owed it to” the record label not to have her first child

www.independent.co.uk

Yes, exactly. I think a lot of people are misunderstanding what he said (willingly misunderstanding it? or because they've developed such a negative predisposition somehow...)
He's clearly talking about public displays of vitriol and hatred and is especially talking about the record industry and the music press and the hypocrisy the latter especially is showing.

Very true as well that his message wasn't "only about himself", as some have said. He obviously feels a kinship with her, which is why he used the title of that song, which he wrote about himself and feels applies to Sinead as well.

Anything that may have been said or done in private means that of course there will be no evidence that we are aware of - but no evidence does not mean anything. It's not rocket science. We simply don't know what may or may not have happened in private so there is no point in assuming anything either way in that regard.
I'm sure like a lot of people recently I've been re-reading the open letter that Sinéad O'Connor wrote to Miley Cyrus. It's an incredibly warm, heart-felt and helpful letter. That Miley responded to it with ridicule and allusions to Sinéad's mental health problems speaks volumes about Miley as a person. Maybe she regrets all that now. Maybe Moz and Miley spoke about it? Who knows. But a legitimate question to ask Moz is why he ever thought that asking such a vapid creature as Miley to do backing vocals was a good idea.

Sinead O’Connor’s open letter with a warning for Miley Cyrus

Cyrus compared the music video for her 2013 hit ‘Wrecking Ball’ to the visuals for O’Connor’s ‘Nothing Compares 2 U’

www.independent.co.uk

I believe Moz did say she was the one to contact him, wanting to get involved in his album. But it remains a good question why he thought it would be a good idea. Guess he thought it'd help sales? Could well have been what made the whole thing fall through in the end.

 

[goinghome]

More on the Lily Allen reaction here, and linking it to Morrissey's statement

https://www.irishmirror.ie/showbiz/lily-allen-blasts-spineless-tributes-30594381

and

https://evoke.ie/2023/07/31/entertainment/celebrity/lily-allen-sinead-oconnor

 

[DaveJCarr]

I believe Moz did say she was the one to contact him, wanting to get involved in his album. But it remains a good question why he thought it would be a good idea. Guess he thought it'd help sales? Could well have been what made the whole thing fall through in the end.

Miley is a fan, is capable of good to excellent singing, has a large fanbase, a solid string of reliably profitable albums for her label(s), and was a vegan for a long stretch. She was probably chosen/suggested with the same (or maybe a smidge more) purpose as say Billy Joel Armstrong on "Wedding Bell Blues."

Moz having backup singers (or even a co-lead) vocalist is not as alien, or rare of a notion as it once may have seemed

 

[Redacted]

Sinéad O'Connor herself did provide some evidence though about things that happened in private that must have been awful to experience, if true.

This is not about Sinead for you, it's about your consistent misogynistic comments about women who have been victimized and your victim blaming, it is despicable. At least Morrissey is not doing that, this time.

 

[Redacted]

He's clearly talking about public displays of vitriol and hatred and is especially talking about the record industry and the music press and the hypocrisy the latter especially is showing.

Can you name any instances where M showed some public support for Sinead? I can't recall any at the moment. Or did he wait for her death, doing the same thing he is accusing so many other people of doing.

 

[Crisstti]

Can you name any instances where M showed some public support for Sinead? I can't recall any at the moment. Or did he wait for her death, doing the same thing he is accusing so many other people of doing.

Can you name any instances where M showed public vitriol for Sinead?

 

[Tibby]

I know I`m a little late on this but the past few weeks have been s**t show for me. I was sad to hear Sinead had passed and just wanted to offer my condolences. I hope she finds peace in the next world that she never found on earth.

 

[Redacted]

Can you name any instances where M showed public vitriol for Sinead?

Why are you dodging the question?

 

[gashonthenail]

This is not about Sinead for you, it's about your consistent misogynistic comments about women who have been victimized and your victim blaming, it is despicable. At least Morrissey is not doing that, this time.

Not sure what you're referring to.
Was simply stating a fact - that Sinéad O'Connor had made an allegation about something that happened in private. Whether I 'believe' her or not is kind of irrelevant. As it happens I do, but what people 'believe' I don't think is very important. Facts are more important than belief. I'm surprised I have to explain that to someone who claims to work in the legal world.
Any allegation of misconduct or criminality should, of course, be taken seriously and, if there is evidence, investigated. But I don't think all 'victims' should be automatically 'believed', definitely not. As we saw with Kevin Spacey, not all allegations are factual. And not all 'victims' are women. So where misogyny comes in to your venom is just baffling. You really are going to end up pickling yourself in your own bile one day.

 

[gashonthenail]

Miley is a fan, is capable of good to excellent singing, has a large fanbase, a solid string of reliably profitable albums for her label(s), and was a vegan for a long stretch. She was probably chosen/suggested with the same (or maybe a smidge more) purpose as say Billy Joel Armstrong on "Wedding Bell Blues."

Moz having backup singers (or even a co-lead) vocalist is not as alien, or rare of a notion as it once may have seemed

Quite. But not sure if I would put Miley in the same league as Kirsty MacColl, Chrissie Hynde, or Siouxsie Sioux.

 

[Redacted]

Not sure what you're referring to.
Was simply stating a fact - that Sinéad O'Connor had made an allegation about something that happened in private. Whether I 'believe' her or not is kind of irrelevant. As it happens I do, but what people 'believe' I don't think is very important. Facts are more important than belief. I'm surprised I have to explain that to someone who claims to work in the legal world.
Any allegation of misconduct or criminality should, of course, be taken seriously and, if there is evidence, investigated. But I don't think all 'victims' should be automatically 'believed', definitely not. As we saw with Kevin Spacey, not all allegations are factual. And not all 'victims' are women. So where misogyny comes in to your venom is just baffling. You really are going to end up pickling yourself in your own bile one day.

Second time, take this to off topic if you are going to attack

 

[Redacted]

Fact checking is apparently foreign to some, Sinead's brother confirmed the allegations of abuse by their mother

Her brother Joseph defended their father to the newspaper but agreed regarding their mother's "extreme and violent abuse, both emotional and physical"

 

[gashonthenail]

Fact checking is apparently foreign to some, Sinead's brother confirmed the allegations of abuse by their mother

Her brother Joseph defended their father to the newspaper but agreed regarding their mother's "extreme and violent abuse, both emotional and physical"

The 'if true' was referring to the allegation that her record company tried to force her to have an abortion, linked to in my post. I wasn't referring to allegations of childhood abuse. You misread my post.

 

[DaveJCarr]

Quite. But not sure if I would put Miley in the same league as Kirsty MacColl, Chrissie Hynde, or Siouxsie Sioux.

Perhaps not. But with the exception of Siouxsie on "interlude" and Thelma Houston on "Bobby, Don't You Think They Know?"

I think there is a colorable argument most of those backup vocals (then or currently in the lineups on California Son for instance) have been dramatically underutilized in the mix. The brief snippet of the recorded version of I Am Veronica that was floating around the last major to her promotion cycle – when it seemed like the Capitol release was imminent – suggests that this particular aspect of underutilized and under-mixed backup vocals on Morrissey records would continue. Hopefully, we will get the chance to officially judge the matter.