The Guardian: "Who’s bad? From Michael Jackson to David Bowie, why are some stars uncancellable" by Tim Jonze - tiny Moz mention (April 1, 2024)

Who’s bad? From Michael Jackson to David Bowie, why are some stars uncancellable?

A Michael Jackson jukebox musical has just opened – with no mention of sexual allegations – and a biopic is coming. What makes some celebrities immune to cancel culture? We examine who gets ostracised and who doesn’t

www.theguardian.com

Excerpt:

How do you grapple with cases in which there are conflicting views and grey areas? Does Morrissey’s embrace of far-right political groups such as For Britain have to be weighed on some kind of moral scale against Johnny Marr’s progressive values, to work out if the Smiths are cancelled? Should Benjamin Zephaniah be shunned for being violent towards a former girlfriend, or is he excused because he was the one who wrote about it, expressing regret and the need to be better? Before long, my list of factors had spiralled into a tangle of nuances and contradictions.

 

[Malarkey]

I agree that hacks influence fans' thinking. But the crank-fraud thing; could you be more specific please?



Wow! Imagine extrapolating in such an absolutist way. And on top of misreading, the gruff and fractious dismissal, reminiscent of the narcissistic authoritarianism seen in someone like Trump. You never can tell about people.

Btw, have you listened to the third episode of Colin Brown's Mozzcast? (Sorry I can't stay annoyed with you for long.) Malarkey is thanked for providing loads of very instructive background material in folk-devil.com -

Colin's a genuine perceptive fan kindly doing a service orienting fans.

Immigration fraud? That's unexpected.

Whatever about other incidents, these offences are negligible, esp. considering recent changes in UK laws to suppress protestors; all the better to target and make monsters out of people like him.

You reckon he should be hanged, drawn and quartered? You think we should all be cancelled by being curious about someone who has become a figure of cultural interest, that has a minor appeal to help understand these divisive times? Is it only the Tim Jonzes of the world that are allowed to mention him without condemnation? Is that not a simplistic stance? Although I guess Morrissey would be well advised at this stage to keep his gaze averted and stay otherwise engaged.

The jail system's been gamed, so that no matter what certain people do, they'll never end up there, as others are booted in for daring to breathe

He means 'honey buns', your Honour.

Robinson could be interesting. The villain is always a great part. The Threepenny Opera is my favourite musical.

 

[gordyboy9]

No. He’s just being offensive. Maybe he hasn’t felt the negative effects of such labels. Lucky him. Some of us have.

offensive,has there ever been a time when this word is thrown about like confetti more than now.
i hear so called film critics on youtube say,i watched the film and it didnt offend me,its as if people wake up in the morning and want to be offeneded.

 

[Margaret]

I know plenty of people on the right who are great people, but do give everyone an example of the left not being able to disagree civilly.

I know plenty of people on the right who are awful people at the core, with vile souls. Johnny is a beautiful person inside, he stated the good things at the right time.

 

[Margaret]

Weren't Muslims child trafficking, and he was speaking up about that? That is really all I know about Tommy Robinson.
The Mexicans are child trafficking here, and when Trump was president and we were holding kids on the border, we were DNA testing them to make sure they were with or going to relatives and the liberals shut that down very fast, I think there was a court order to release them before they could all be tested, and it's certain some of them were with traffickers. The Mexicans also have rape gangs, but we are supposed to ignore it. They break into houses and rape little girls in their beds, nothing to see here.

Supremacism is a plague, despise the persons who express it

 

[Redacted]

I know plenty of people on the right who are awful people at the core, with vile souls. Johnny is a beautiful person inside, he stated the good things at the right time.

I love awful people

 

[DagenhamDan]

I love awful people

 

[JRB]

The problem M has is that he's not a big enough star to be 'protected' by the industry in the way that Bowie, Jackson or Kanye West were / are. He's not making anyone enough money, particularly his solo stuff. The Smiths, as can be seen, have not been thrown under the bus, probably because the other three dilute his impact. Also Johnny Marr is no fool and values the legacy and this will be why he's putting the legwork in on building his profile, popping up on British mainstream TV and media right left and centre over the last year, as if to mitigate M's poor profile.
M made the comment a few years ago along the lines that racism is the worst thing you can be accused of. It does seem to be true that its worse than child abuse allegations (Jackson), alleged sex with minors (Bowie) or even quite well-founded accusations of a couple of Beatles who were heavy with their fists where their wives were concerned. But if you've got back catalogues valued in the $billions and estates that turn over tens or hundreds of $millions a year it is worth protecting the artist's reputation.
The other factor is that M hates journalists and doesn't play the game. If you talk to the press, befriend journalists, open up in interviews, appear on reality TV shows, play the fame game etc you can get away with a lot. Boy George springs to mind. I always wonder how M is regarded as a persona non grata and to the right of Hitler when he has never actually broken any laws, yet Boy George can handcuff someone to a radiator and beat them with a metal chain yet be regarded as a UK national treasure.

 

[gashonthenail]

Supremacism is a plague, despise the persons who express it

You have just expressed supremacism yourself. You think all people on the right are inferior.

 

[Redacted]

Supremacism is a plague, despise the persons who express it

Daft much? I am talking about child rape, but thanks for illustrating the point that anyone on the left will find a way to excuse it when it's someone who is brown and will completely ignore the victims and the horrific crimes. This is how and why the Muslim rape and grooming gangs were allowed to operate for so long, no one wanted to be accused of racism.

 

[Redacted]

BTW, I was recently publicly called a racist by a black politician in my city for expressing some concern about things that are happening and never once said nor implied I was talking about black people, and I wasn't, but this person insisted I was. 4 other policitians agreed. They all took turns chastising me, it was awesome. Of course, they are all woke lefties.
I am pretty proud of myself that I caused such a mass triggering and hope to do it again soon.

 

[ZZ Top]

All you Misserrey fans - just look at the people defending your master. This is what you have become. Own it.

 

[ZZ Top]

BTW, I was recently publicly called a racist by a black politician in my city for expressing some concern about things that are happening and never once said nor implied I was talking about black people, and I wasn't, but this person insisted I was. 4 other policitians agreed. They all took turns chastising me, it was awesome. Of course, they are all woke lefties.
I am pretty proud of myself that I caused such a mass triggering and hope to do it again soon.

Bizarre they would think that though. None of your posts would indicate such a thing. Folks, Your typical Misserrey fan right here.

 

[Gregor Samsa]

BTW, I was recently publicly called a racist by a black politician in my city for expressing some concern about things that are happening and never once said nor implied I was talking about black people, and I wasn't, but this person insisted I was. 4 other policitians agreed. They all took turns chastising me, it was awesome. Of course, they are all woke lefties.
I am pretty proud of myself that I caused such a mass triggering and hope to do it again soon.

You should put as much effort into being a decent person.

 

[gashonthenail]

Yeah, that sounds plausible and not at all reminiscent of the anti-Jew propaganda of old.

Venezuela and Cuba have been emptying their prisons and asylums. They aren't coming to the USA to take up basket weaving. Lawlessness in the big cities is going to lose Biden the election in November. Little doubt of that.

 

[ZZ Top]

Yep, that was the start of it all. The start of the bleakest 18 month period in Morrissey's several decades of fame. The only positive is that it did at least end in spring 2019 - there's been nothing to add to it all since.

Are you mad? Virtually every other thing he has said since then is a right wing trope.

 

[Gregor Samsa]

Venezuela and Cuba have been emptying their prisons and asylums. They aren't coming to the USA to take up basket weaving. Lawlessness in the big cities is going to lose Biden the election in November. Little doubt of that.

Right!

 

[Redacted]

Bizarre they would think that though. None of your posts would indicate such a thing. Folks, Your typical Misserrey fan right here.

What? That because they didn't like what I was saying, they smeared me, or tried to? What I said was in writing, anyone could read what they were talking about and know they were lying. And yes. I am feeling pretty good about knowing how much what I actually did say got under their skin. Morrissey should just own what he says. I say that all the time. Do not explain or defend yourself, because then the nothing burger just gets bigger. Their credibility was ruined, not mine.

 

[Redacted]

What? That because they didn't like what I was saying, they smeared me, or tried to? What I said was in writing, anyone could read what they were talking about and know they were lying. And yes. I am feeling pretty good about knowing how much what I actually did say got under their skin. Morrissey should just own what he says. I say that all the time. Do not explain or defend yourself, because then the nothing burger just gets bigger. Their credibility was ruined, not mine.

Edit to Add - I rarely defend Morrissey, I get called a hater all the time.

 

[TheSmiths_1985]

offensive,has there ever been a time when this word is thrown about like confetti more than now.
i hear so called film critics on youtube say,i watched the film and it didnt offend me,its as if people wake up in the morning and want to be offeneded.

Because it just is offensive. The same way I would find it offensive if someone called me a fenian. Or kicked the f*** out of me because I was a fenian, or petrol bombed our house because we were fenians, or murdered members of my family because they were a taig.
Do you call black people “the n word”? Or Asian people “the p word”? Actually, you probably do… but, hey, it’s their problem if they’re offeneded, right Gordon?

 

[gordyboy9]

Because it just is offensive. The same way I would find it offensive if someone called me a fenian. Or kicked the f*** out of me because I was a fenian, or petrol bombed our house because we were fenians, or murdered members of my family because they were a taig.
Do you call black people “the n word”? Or Asian people “the p word”? Actually, you probably do… but, hey, it’s their problem if they’re offeneded, right Gordon?

i would never call anybody names of that sort,i was brought up better than that.
when you support the tic in scotland everyone is against you,the sfa,the referees,other teams,the daily record,radio phone ins,yesterday mcoist said he and 48000 will be breaking the new hate crime bill,he has backtracked today.