The Guardian: "Who’s bad? From Michael Jackson to David Bowie, why are some stars uncancellable" by Tim Jonze - tiny Moz mention (April 1, 2024)

Who’s bad? From Michael Jackson to David Bowie, why are some stars uncancellable?

A Michael Jackson jukebox musical has just opened – with no mention of sexual allegations – and a biopic is coming. What makes some celebrities immune to cancel culture? We examine who gets ostracised and who doesn’t

www.theguardian.com

Excerpt:

How do you grapple with cases in which there are conflicting views and grey areas? Does Morrissey’s embrace of far-right political groups such as For Britain have to be weighed on some kind of moral scale against Johnny Marr’s progressive values, to work out if the Smiths are cancelled? Should Benjamin Zephaniah be shunned for being violent towards a former girlfriend, or is he excused because he was the one who wrote about it, expressing regret and the need to be better? Before long, my list of factors had spiralled into a tangle of nuances and contradictions.

 

[Gregor Samsa]

There's nothing wrong with being right wing. I have issues with some of the things Morrissey has said but leaning right is not one of them. A lot of people used to be on the left, but the left has gone insane and made it impossible to support them and I think Morrissey may have expressed that sentiment.

Yes, let’s storm the Capitol. That’s the sane thing to do.

 

[gashonthenail]

Tommy Robinson is a working class man from Luton who, wait for it, argued that the massive ethnic and cultural change that was happening to his town was having negative consequences. Clearly though that is something you are not allowed to say. There is nothing 'progressive' about supporting mass immigration. Look around Britain, and Europe today, has mass immigration brought progress? The people of Sweden, the people of Denmark, the people of Holland...the list is endless...think otherwise. Ask any working class person in Britain what they think of Tommy Robinson - some will agree with him, some will disagree with him, but I am yet to meet any working class person in Britain who doesn't think he is allowed to have an opinion about the country he lives in.

 

[Gregor Samsa]

Tommy Robinson is a working class man from Luton who, wait for it, argued that the massive ethnic and cultural change that was happening to his town was having negative consequences. Clearly though that is something you are not allowed to say. There is nothing 'progressive' about supporting mass immigration. Look around Britain, and Europe today, has mass immigration brought progress? The people of Sweden, the people of Denmark, the people of Holland...the list is endless...think otherwise. Ask any working class person in Britain what they think of Tommy Robinson - some will agree with him, some will disagree with him, but I am yet to meet any working class person in Britain who doesn't think he is allowed to have an opinion about the country he lives in.

Maybe a lot of people are irked by his constant support of far-right groups (BNP, EDL), his violent crimes and stalking journalists. Surely it’s reasonable to feel that way?

 

[Surface]

Tommy Robinson is a working class man from Luton who, wait for it, argued that the massive ethnic and cultural change that was happening to his town was having negative consequences. Clearly though that is something you are not allowed to say. There is nothing 'progressive' about supporting mass immigration. Look around Britain, and Europe today, has mass immigration brought progress? The people of Sweden, the people of Denmark, the people of Holland...the list is endless...think otherwise. Ask any working class person in Britain what they think of Tommy Robinson - some will agree with him, some will disagree with him, but I am yet to meet any working class person in Britain who doesn't think he is allowed to have an opinion about the country he lives in.

He's also a nasty piece of work.

Robinson has been convicted for multiple crimes involving violence, stalking, financial and immigration fraud, drug possession, public order offences, and contempt of court. He has served at least four separate prison terms: for assault in 2005, for using false travel documents to enter the United States in 2012, for mortgage fraud in 2014, and 13 months in 2018 for contempt of court after publishing a Facebook Livevideo of defendants entering a law court (contravening a court order that disallows reporting on such trials while proceedings are ongoing).

 

[Redacted]

Woke ideology has defintely taken a hold and I think it's most dangerous on college campuses. College is where you are taught to think and where you are supposed to learn.
Friend of a friend has a podcast, we were all asked to listen to get the numbers up. Podcaster is a PhD and college professor who attempts to tackle legal and political topics, and fails every time. In the most recent episode, podcaster goes on about how she feels she doesn't need to listen to someone or be polite to someone holding a different or offensive viewpoint and if you are dealing with someone who becomes emotional while you are trying to have what I presume to be an adult conversation with an exchange of ideas, you have to 'make space' for the 'marginalized' person to be emotional because, well, because. So I am thinking, aren't you asking me to do what you call 'emotional labor', which is bad and burdensome. Aren't you asking me to manage someone's emotional reaction while having a normal conversation? Am I really supposed to sit there and deal with it? And what if you have a student who disagrees with your point of view, or has a point of view you find offensive? Do you just not teach that student? Ignore them?
This is the left today and you can even see examples in this thread.
BTW, this is a professor of Communications. This person cannot even get facts straight and consistently twists and contorts the meaning of everything with her alternate facts, it's kind of scary.

 

[Redacted]

Spare us the scum. Morrissey's right wing views are an embarassment. Johnny is the only left who is humanist, he will surely cry for childlren and women starving in Gaza.

I know plenty of people on the right who are great people, but do give everyone an example of the left not being able to disagree civilly.

 

[Redacted]

Well, because by not saying something like "I mean, look at the shocking treatment of Tommy Robinson...I disagree with some of his views and his propensity for thuggish violence, but he should be allowed to stand up for his views" - then Morrissey leaves himself open to all journalists, for the rest of his life, being able to lazily write "Morrissey supports / supported Tommy Robinson". But maybe he's 100% fine with that.

Isn't that basically all he said tho? That Tommy Robinson was not being allowed free speech?

 

[Gregor Samsa]

Woke ideology has defintely taken a hold and I think it's most dangerous on college campuses. College is where you are taught to think and where you are supposed to learn.
Friend of a friend has a podcast, we were all asked to listen to get the numbers up. Podcaster is a PhD and college professor who attempts to tackle legal and political topics, and fails every time. In the most recent episode, podcaster goes on about how she feels she doesn't need to listen to someone or be polite to someone holding a different or offensive viewpoint and if you are dealing with someone who becomes emotional while you are trying to have what I presume to be an adult conversation with an exchange of ideas, you have to 'make space' for the 'marginalized' person to be emotional because, well, because. So I am thinking, aren't you asking me to do what you call 'emotional labor', which is bad and burdensome. Aren't you asking me to manage someone's emotional reaction while having a normal conversation? Am I really supposed to sit there and deal with it? And what if you have a student who disagrees with your point of view, or has a point of view you find offensive? Do you just not teach that student? Ignore them?
This is the left today and you can even see examples in this thread.
BTW, this is a professor of Communications. This person cannot even get facts straight and consistently twists and contorts the meaning of everything with her alternate facts, it's kind of scary.

Luckily, this person is quite unique. And luckily angry YouTubers will never replace colleges or universities - despite how badly the far-right wants to.

 

[Gregor Samsa]

I know plenty of people on the right who are great people, but do give everyone an example of the left not being able to disagree civilly.

Storming the Capitol isn’t the best example of disagreeing civilly. Nor is refusing to admit defeat.

 

[nicky wire's legs]

Tommy Robinson is da man!!!

 

[gashonthenail]

You won't see this on the BBC...

 

[That's Enough For Me]

Maybe we just don't 'cancel' anyone at all and stop dictating what should and shouldn't be heard.

 

[Surface]

Tommy Robinson is da man!!!

If you like thugs I suppose he is.

Robinson is a violent thug. His criminal record includes being jailed for 12 months for two charges of assault in 2005, one causing actual bodily harm. In 2011, he was convicted of assault for an attack at an English Defence League (EDL) march in Blackburn and the same year he was found guilty of leading an attack on rival fans by 100 Luton Town supporters. As he was led away he was chanting ‘EDL till I die.’

More worryingly, he actually encourages organized violence. The EDL, which he headed up, organized gangs of hooligans to terrorise communities across the country, and Robinson was open about its aim.

 

[That's Enough For Me]

If you like thugs I suppose he is.

Robinson is a violent thug. His criminal record includes being jailed for 12 months for two charges of assault in 2005, one causing actual bodily harm. In 2011, he was convicted of assault for an attack at an English Defence League (EDL) march in Blackburn and the same year he was found guilty of leading an attack on rival fans by 100 Luton Town supporters. As he was led away he was chanting ‘EDL till I die.’

More worryingly, he actually encourages organized violence. The EDL, which he headed up, organized gangs of hooligans to terrorise communities across the country, and Robinson was open about its aim.

At some point this year, we will encouraged to vote for a selection of political parties, all of whom will encourage organised violence if elected. Shall we cancel politics too?

 

[gashonthenail]

If you like thugs I suppose he is.

Robinson is a violent thug. His criminal record includes being jailed for 12 months for two charges of assault in 2005, one causing actual bodily harm. In 2011, he was convicted of assault for an attack at an English Defence League (EDL) march in Blackburn and the same year he was found guilty of leading an attack on rival fans by 100 Luton Town supporters. As he was led away he was chanting ‘EDL till I die.’

More worryingly, he actually encourages organized violence. The EDL, which he headed up, organized gangs of hooligans to terrorise communities across the country, and Robinson was open about its aim.

People can change can't they?
As much as a third of men in the UK have a criminal record. That figure is much higher for working class men.
Are you the same person you were 15 years ago?

 

[Surface]

People can change can't they?
As much as a third of men in the UK have a criminal record. That figure is much higher for working class men.
Are you the same person you were 15 years ago?

Doesn't look like it in Robinsons case and yes I am the same person I was 15 years ago.

On 22 January 2024, at Westminster Magistrates’ Court, Robinson denied the Section 35 charge claiming he attended the march as a journalist. The District Judge set a trial for 22 April with Robinson's application to prevent the publication of address denied. The Metropolitan Police claimed Robinson "resisted as officers attempted to put him in handcuffs" and "was warned repeatedly before PAVA spray was used".[220]

 

[Redacted]

Weren't Muslims child trafficking, and he was speaking up about that? That is really all I know about Tommy Robinson.
The Mexicans are child trafficking here, and when Trump was president and we were holding kids on the border, we were DNA testing them to make sure they were with or going to relatives and the liberals shut that down very fast, I think there was a court order to release them before they could all be tested, and it's certain some of them were with traffickers. The Mexicans also have rape gangs, but we are supposed to ignore it. They break into houses and rape little girls in their beds, nothing to see here.

 

[gashonthenail]

Doesn't look like it in Robinsons case and yes I am the same person I was 15 years ago.

On 22 January 2024, at Westminster Magistrates’ Court, Robinson denied the Section 35 charge claiming he attended the march as a journalist. The District Judge set a trial for 22 April with Robinson's application to prevent the publication of address denied. The Metropolitan Police claimed Robinson "resisted as officers attempted to put him in handcuffs" and "was warned repeatedly before PAVA spray was used".[220]

Are you really the same person you were 15 years ago? Jesus, you must have a very closed mind and outlook on life if you have not learned anything new and matured as a human being. I am a very different person from the person I was 15 years ago.

 

[Gregor Samsa]

Weren't Muslims child trafficking, and he was speaking up about that? That is really all I know about Tommy Robinson.
The Mexicans are child trafficking here, and when Trump was president and we were holding kids on the border, we were DNA testing them to make sure they were with or going to relatives and the liberals shut that down very fast, I think there was a court order to release them before they could all be tested, and it's certain some of them were with traffickers. The Mexicans also have rape gangs, but we are supposed to ignore it. They break into houses and rape little girls in their beds, nothing to see here.

Yeah, that sounds plausible and not at all reminiscent of the anti-Jew propaganda of old.

 

[Gregor Samsa]

Are you really the same person you were 15 years ago? Jesus, you must have a very closed mind and outlook on life if you have not learned anything new and matured as a human being. I am a very different person from the person I was 15 years ago.

Main point is, Robinson hasn’t really changed. He’s still violent and a criminal.